Tones (E-Trac)

[Gator01]

First, Im new to the forum, but have several years, mainly Whites machines, and the only multi tone machine Ive used was a M6.
I am having troubles finding a good signal due to iron false tones.
I hunt mainly old house sites. Biggest trash is iron in the ground, Im sure most of you have been there.
I know how to work a signal from previous experience, walk around and try and get a good signal from several directions, raising coil to see if it is something large, crushed aluminum can, or can slaw, etc.
It really eats my time up, seems each swing i get numerous high tones, and have to check each out.
I have used the stock coin program, with pretty much factory settings, I have change a couple things, but still same results as far as false issues.
I also have used TTF with a nail disc pattern. Pretty much, with my other machines, I always use just enough disc to knock out nails at these sites.
So, how do you guys deal with this, I feel you have and still experience this. Are you using much discrimination?? Dropping your gain ( I keep mine at 24 for now). Reducing sensitivity:huh:
And I have dug many of these signals, to find a large nail, small, or piece of one or other odd rusty iron.
Like I said, I still do not have many hours on the machine, and just was curious if any of you could shed some light on how you handle these high pitch signals.
Thanks again,
Gator
:groovy:

[earthmansurfer]

I'm new to the E-Trac but I would suggest running auto sensitivity and to me, yes I would look at sensitivity first (as with many detectors). That should greatly cut down on false signals. If the ground is wet you may want to lower the sensitivity even more. Do you know you can run auto from -3 to +3?

Make sure you are doing a noise cancel before your hunt and do it every 30 minutes or so. Andy Sabisch says to do it on the ground - a clean area!

When you find a signal, you can also go to the open quick mask screen and see if it spends more time in the bottom right corner of the screen - dead giveaway for iron.

As with any detector, if you are hunting a trashy place, it's best to use a smaller coil like the :loveit:6 SEF or the like.

I run pretty much the factory coin program as far as iron discrim goes.

Hope that was helpful,
Albert

[tracyjm]

I'm fairly new with the E-Trac and have been running into the same thing. The ground is so wet where I live that I think it is one of the main causes of falsing on nails. In the ETrac's defense I have also found several coins in the same hole with as many as 3 nails. How in the world did this not knock out the coin signal. I think I will back slightly off on the sensitivity if the weather will let me out a few more times. The ETrac has not been lacking on depth yet so it might really clean up the sounds on the good stuff. Hang in there...John

[randy]

Iron falses do not sound quite as good as the sweet sound of silver. The difference is subtle, and it took me many, many hours on the E-Trac to tell the difference, but eventually it clicks.

For lack of better words, iron falses sound a bit sharper, and the sweet sound of silver is smoother, and, well, sweet (and quite unmistakable once you have heard it alot).

I use response long, and sizing pinpointing. The former allows the sweet sound of silver on a coin to sound a bit longer than the tip of a nail, and the latter allows you to pinpoint the shape of a nail. Alot of people don't like sizing pinpointing, but I find it helps me see the shape of nails, bolts, and other ferrous targets.

As you are learning the machine, you will have to dig alot of ferrous (IMHO, anyway). That's how you learn the difference. And, BTW, I recommend cranking the sens on manual as high as you can stand (as conditions merit -- +4 past the auto +3 recommendation). (And yes, noise cancel on the ground unless near an obvious source of EMI or in an urban park -- in that case, noise cancel both 12 inches above and on the ground, and make a decision on which channel to use based on conditions).

EDIT: My response assumes you are using multi tones conductive. If using TTF, use auto +3, and you should see much less iron falsing -- dig any high tone. (I guess its unclear if you are experiencing alot of iron falsing in TTF using auto +3; I have not had that problem, and don't have an answer if that is your problem) (and of course don't use Response Long in TTF lol)

[Gator01]

Ive used both conductive and TTF. I hunt a lot of older spots with lots of old nails in the ground. I try to use just enough disc to get rid of the nails.
In TTF, I do get the high tones off the nails.
I have a lot of older coins, barbers, indian heads, buffalos, war nicks, Mercs, wheaties etc. Plus I have several pieces of trash, old rusty nails also. Ive been running all those under the coil, out in the yard scattered on the grass. Trying to get a grip on this. Even in TTF with an open quick mask, I still get the high tones off of iron, now, if in the disc pattern, depending on how the nail lays, I will get a null but if the coin is close to that small nail, it doesnt sound off, but sweeping from another direction it will and sometimes the nail will sound also, Guess I just have to be lucky enough to catch it in the right direction, plus this is a huge statement about using a grid and working a spot from several directions.
Anyway, I can sometimes with no doubt tell that iron high squeal, but many times it is subtle like a coin, to my ears. I keep doing this over and over, trying to remember the good sound of a round coin.
Someone suggested long instead of normal response. Ive experimented in the house and yard with all the response settings. I think if I was to swap from normal, I would try long. I dont much care for the others, at this time.
Wife says Im stubborn and hard headed, maybe its just gonna take a long time for me to get the tones down.
I found two buffalos, second time out, and they were in amongst iron tones, but the lower tones were easy for me to work. I was using Conductive, Multi tones at that time but I was in town where the old lot had the iron in the ground plus other modern junk metal.
Thank guys. for your time,
and Merry Christmas
John

[Bell-Two]

As best I can describe it iron will tend to have what I call a scratchy edge to it as the coil comes off of it. Turning and sweeping can help too. Now sometimes you get a good smooth sound that is the dominant sound with some scratchy sound that means it could be a good target mixed with iron, in that case narrow your sweep until you just wiggle, if good sound repeats during wiggle dig! In TTF you must rely a bit more on numbers...but your numbers will not be as good sometimes because of the iron bleed through...confusing I know but only experience can help in TTF. I hope I have not confused it for you but don't worry about digging some junk just take it as a learning experience.

[Gator01]

Thanks, Ive dug plenty over the years, a little more want any I guess.
HH,
John

[jkress]

Great question Gator01. :yes:

Although I don't use an E-Trac... but a Minelab Explorer SE. Pinpointing on the machine will often give me helpful information whether the target is iron, coin or a coin mixed with iron.

You should get a confident coin pinpoint eventually if the coin is mixed with iron. Just iron tends to be much softer on the 'on-off' target hit.

Two hunts ago I pulled out 3 rusty bottle caps, one nail and a wheat cent from a six inch diameter hole. :confused: I was blown away when the coin eventually made it's way out.

Hope this helps. :)