V3i, I never Have Seen More Than 6 Displayed

[MartinL]

People continue to say the V3i is a deep seeker, yet I have had my V3i for going on 5 months and I have NEVER seen a displayed depth in PP(true depth reading) beyond 6 inches. I use the 6x10DD coil almost always, but have run the 10&quot:grin:cheesysmile: also, still nothing beyond 6. Either I am missing something, such as maybe always using three frequencies only instead of using the lower freqs, but I continue to miss the display saying even 7 or 8, much less 10 as people report here. Maybe this particular V3i of mine is deficient for anything beyond 6, and a lot of V3i machines are the same since I've read the same despondence from other new users. I've read a similar complaints on another board when I asked the same exact question, but back up factoid from other owners having the same depth issue, got me nothing from the so called experts except ridicule.

Why have I never gotten a pin point display on a coin sized target beyond 6? It's driving me nuts! Maybe this site will yield REAL support instead of, Read the manuals you lazy bum! If my threshold of depth limit wasn't almost precisely at 6, I'd assume maybe there's no targets yet beyond 6. FOUR MONTHS THOUGH! The odds are against it. Maybe y'all can give some key settings for me to at least begin to see displayed depths beyond 6. Do you V3i owners get depth beyond 6 in the 3-freq factory programs? Is there one danged setup that will push this V3i to depth? Hope my White's dealer didn't sell be me a lame duck right from the start. Do those guys have a conscience against pushing problem detectors onto new faces? Hope not.

Thank you in advance. martin

[M-Taliesin]

Howdy Martin!
I have a simple question, and I hope this doesn't sound stupid, but are you telling the machine which coil it has on the end of the stick when you change coils?

Then again, I've never found anything beyond 5 or 6 inches on my V3i, and if it ain't any deeper than that, the display may be correct. Do you find coins that are deeper than reported on your V3/i display?

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

[MartinL]

Yes I am telling it that the 6x10 or the 10&quot:grin:cheesysmile: coil is in place Mel. As far as finding coins deeper than 6...not with the V3i so far. If my V3i in PP says 3, or 4, or 5, my coin target when dug has been just about on the money(pardon the pun) once I retrieve it, so the accuracy of the machine is very good below 6. I did used to dig deep targets with my 5900 though, and the analog meter agreed is was an 7 to 9 dig ahead of time. it's just this V that's hung in granny gear for depth. Like I said earlier, I always search in 3 freqs, but I have used the Deep Silver program in attempts to find something over 6 deep.

IF there is anyone who remembers what program they used when seeing deep targets beyond 6, I would appreciate know what key settings I am missing. I tried a few of the custom programs by the tenured hunters, but still am stuck at the 6 threshold. If I ever dug some coin say at 7, it wasn't much more than what the indicated display in PP said it was. I'm missing deep stuff, that's all there is to it. martin

[Dimeman]

Since I don't own a V3(i) I can't offer any assistance on that model, but most models with a depth reading should work very similar---------- if you get a target that shows ..( let's say)6 inches......try raising the coil a few inches above the target and see if the depth reading increases on the meter. If it does change.......... it could be possible the areas you are searching have very few, if any, coins deeper than 6 inches.

[Evan/tn]

I don't think i have dug any coin sized object any deeper than about 5 inches over the last year :confused:
That's why I've been using the MXT a lot,i just seem to dig and hear deeper signals,All i use are the factory programs with a little tweaking.
But im about through with it.

[giant056]

When I first got my V3i I wasn't so sure it wasn't even hearing the stuff down there very deep so I tried the deep silver program and did find a deep silver ring and silver quarter with it the second day I owned it, the ring was probably 7 inches and the quarter was about 8. I got so I also like Hi-pro a lot cause I was able to hear deep coins with it. I think getting use to the different responses on the stock programs kinda helped me quite a bit getting use to what the machine was telling me so I put some different programs in it, the first couple were way to radical and the third one I tried was Magic's and then I really started getting deep targets. Magic is in Indiana and I'm in Michigan and our soil probably isn't a whole lot different is what I figure is the reason this program works so good in my soil, it was made for it. I made some changes to it but the basic program is there. Magic's program actually falses rarely whereas the stock coin jewelry program does it a lot is one thing I noticed about this program that I like plus you can crank it up if you want but actually the way I have mine set I still hear the deep stuff.

[CyberSage]

Hello Martin!
I will do my best to answer your question with my concept of what is going on with your readings. First and foremost the 6x10 coil is not designed for depth. It has a 6 inch width That's 4 inches narrower than the D2 coil. So if your using the 6X10 the majority of the time your not going to get deeper coin readings on a regular basis. Try using your D2 coil exclusively for a while. The other thing to consider is your Filter settings. Higher filter settings can cause you to not see deeper targets. Try using 5.0 Hz or 7.5 Hz Band Pass. You will need to swing slower. The V3/V3i is actually tunned for the 950 Coil, but is fairly accurate estimations on deeper target. If you have the V3i then you can set your coil type setting to make the reading accurate.
In general deeper targets are going to be more difficult to pick out. Just because you have a detector that is capable of deep finds does not mean that you can just go out and find deep coins. It takes practice, good programing, and being in the right place to find the desired targets. Take a copper penny and plant it in some clean ground about 7 inches down. Test your depth readings over this test coin. While it does not represent a long buried coin, it will give you depth readings that should be accurate. Martin, thanks for your good question. I would like to here back about your experiences with the planted penny.

Jack

EDIT: Here is a link to the program I currently use...

http://www.americandetectorist.com/forum/index.php?topic=1860.msg20871#msg20871

[wingmaster]

I've hunted with magic and he seems to be in tune with the V3i for sure, he pulls deep coins on a regular basis with it. That being said I still like my MXT as it doesn't have a problem seeing the deep targets even compaired to the V3i. Now the V3i does have some nice features like the offset for the frequency that would be handy to try in helping with a bad EMI area or the 3 frequency to choose from. I've heard that the V3 will get deeper in one freq rather than all 3 at once, I don't know this for sure as I don't have one but there some nice features on the V3. I don't think I would pay the price difference for the V3 over the MXT but thats just me and I like the fact that if I need to make a change when hunting I don't have to go through the menu to change something.

[ec121connie]

Just a thought.

If you have Modulation on and your volume levels are set low there is a good possibility that you'll pass over those deep targets and never hear them.

Turn Modulation = OFF. That will improve your target volume

Regards,

[tanacat]

EDIT: Here is a link to the program I currently use...

http://www.americandetectorist.com/forum/index.php?topic=1860.msg20871#msg20871



Thanks for the link to your Correlate program Jack. I'm going to try it out :)


The V3i is still pretty new to me and I'm having the same trouble as others-not finding deep silver/readings over 6 ....Or perhaps I'm just not swinging over 'em yet lol

[My4Kiwis]

I'll be heading home next week and Jack's program will the first one I load up. Thanks for posting the link...great explanation of the details there.

[MartinL]

This actually goes out for both the buried copper penny(clad) and the modulation being set to off. First, the penny went down to a 7 depth and made sure the ground was compact as much as possible. Then I flipped on the V3i and ground balanced, swung slowly and got repeated(good tones too) with a readings of 7 & 1/4 on the display of depth in search. In PP, I got 6 & 3/4, but I got no audio at all. This experiment brought me full sircle to a previous problem, No audio in pin point. I did switch off the modulation and swept again, turned up speaker volume to max, and got the the same results.

I was happy to see the near depth accuracy of this freshly buried coin, and the fact that it seeked and reported a coin at 7. Any ideas for the no tone in PP? The 3-freq bars are dancing, but no tone. Maybe I'll kill two birds with one stone here if I can fix the no tone in PP also. Seeing the 7 depth indication was promising. Let me know if you have more ideas after reading this, and thanks very much. martin

FYI, I went back out(cold outside!) and tried both Yahoo's and Jacks' correlate proggys because I couldn't be sure which I used for the report above.

1. Yahoo's worked a bit better in search, but not by much, yet the PP audio was still gone. Like I said, the three freq bars were active during PP, and the expected depth reading was there, 6 3/4 to 7.

2. Jacks correlate program found basically the same depth readings, and it did just barely made a growling tone in PP when I insistently pressed and rubbed on the ground with the coil. I then decided to hunt a bit, moved over about a foot in distance, and hit an 89-92 VDI target, with a displayed depth of 8 1/4 in search mode. Pinpoint mode gave 8 1/2 but no tone.

Interesting stuff, huh. m

[coinnut]

Don't know anything about that machine, but is there a volume control you can set for the pinpoint mode?? Could it be set to 0 (zero)??

[KYBuzzBox]

thumbsup01 WTG Martin! Would it be possible for you to list the settings of the program you are using? It might give us some insight as to your PP issue. The V3i has so many audio and on/off toggles in the menus that it would be easy to overlook one. Are you using the Wireless Headphones? HH...KYBuzzBox

[MartinL]

Don't know anything about that machine, but is there a volume control you can set for the pinpoint mode?? Could it be set to 0 (zero)??


No but it could be set to very low. I do get good PP tone if I am at depths of say 5 or less. I hope there's a volume level or a threshold value ot something, to get the tone for these extra inches above 5 or 5 and a half when in PP. The no audio in PP post made on another board got zilch, even though there were several others who stated the same issue, BUT we were new owners of the V3i so it had to be our faults hence the repeated replies from the astute...Read the manuals again. Granted, I did perfect my PPing swings a bit and gain ground, but these limited depth tones above 6 is still very disturbing. Worst case might be that I'll have to accept no tone, and trust the frequency bars and depth indicators, with no tone. A $1500 machine shouldn't make you have to do that though.

As far as the settings go,,,I took the C&J FAC file and created both Yahoo's and Jacks' programs. If there are key settings I need to focus on, let me know. The Whites people did one thing silly with the V3i, making the VCO off as a default. They probably made another stupid default elsewhere too. Hopefully the tone in PP issue will be discovered here, cuz others have written about the same thing at other times, on other sites. No answers, or if there was, there wasn't a report made. Those were nutty times over there on the manufacturer's forum, so it could have been anything.

It is getting interesting though that I can feel better about the depth limit beyond 6. Y'all have been a help and comfort with your patience. martin

[KYBuzzBox]

Hi Martin,

I know that your V3i is somewhat newer than mine. I have never had an issue with PinPointing tones on my V3i and I have been using it for almost two years. I just wonder if White's didn't change the software defaults on the newer factory V3i's rather than the older V3's that were upgraded to the V3i software? I will check my settings and see if I can find anything that might cause your issue. Maybe Jack can give us an answer as to where to look. I have noticed that all of the users that have the PP issue are using the newer model V3i's.

KYBuzzBox

[MartinL]

Now this is kinda depressing. I had a good post made about my recent results, lengthy in content, and then I get this reply from the attempted post, You are not allowed to access this section, but I'll have to poke at a moderator as to why, and as to why I couldn't retrieve my lost typed words by paging back.

The V3i gets screwy when you change one parameter, such as the VCO or an audio threshold, and you can't get it back by simply returning the setting back to original. I have to do a formal restore of the file and start over. What kind of electronic device these days requires one change at a time, and then forces you to sweep clean to the original status? It makes it darn difficult to tweak and actually believe you have the concrete, top level performance from these V3is. Seriously, I was in success mode an hour ago. Tweaked one thing in audio and than it was worse, so a reverse of the setting would make you think you'd be back to the current success, right? Whites really needs to address the firmware, the hardware GUI so called live controls and how they act together on the fly. I am not impressed at all.

I'm taking a brake. martin

[coinnut]

Now this is kinda depressing. I had a good post made about my recent results, lengthy in content, and then I get this reply from the attempted post, You are not allowed to access this section, but I'll have to poke at a moderator as to why, and as to why I couldn't retrieve my lost typed words by paging back.

The V3i gets screwy when you change one parameter, such as the VCO or an audio threshold, and you can't get it back by simply returning the setting back to original. I have to do a formal restore of the file and start over. What kind of electronic device these days requires one change at a time, and then forces you to sweep clean to the original status? It makes it darn difficult to tweak and actually believe you have the concrete, top level performance from these V3is. Seriously, I was in success mode an hour ago. Tweaked one thing in audio and than it was worse, so a reverse of the setting would make you think you'd be back to the current success, right? Whites really needs to address the firmware, the hardware GUI so called live controls and how they act together on the fly. I am not impressed at all.

I'm taking a brake. martin


Hey Martin, So far I have no idea why your post would not go through :confused: I can't see what you could have hit to access a restricted area, so I'm just wondering if it was something on your computer's side (as to a refresh rate) because it a lenghty waiting period before you hit the post button.. When I hit a back button if I have been working on a post, and it's been too long, I don't get my words back unless I hit the back button twice. Then it refreshes the screens and gives me my original back. Sorry this happened to you. I sometimes highlite the whole story and cut it just in case I lose it. Then I can just paste it on a new post. Maybe someone else can chime in

[KYBuzzBox]

That's not good. I make changes to my programs all of the time. I only had to do a restore once when I first got my V3i upgrade back. I restored all of the programs from the library just to insure there was no corruption (we programmer types are a little eccentric on things like that :thinkingabout:).

I think you need to call White's and send that unit in. You should be able to make any changes you want, save them, and use them (you may/may not have to re-GB) without having to restore. I would call Carl at whites, it sounds like your V3i unit has a serious issue with the program memory on a main board. It should be covered under warranty.

KYBuzzBox

[MartinL]

Hey Martin, So far I have no idea why your post would not go through :confused: I can't see what you could have hit to access a restricted area, so I'm just wondering if it was something on your computer's side (as to a refresh rate) because it a lenghty waiting period before you hit the post button.. When I hit a back button if I have been working on a post, and it's been too long, I don't get my words back unless I hit the back button twice. Then it refreshes the screens and gives me my original back. Sorry this happened to you. I sometimes highlite the whole story and cut it just in case I lose it. Then I can just paste it on a new post. Maybe someone else can chime in


I'm good. I have had this same scenario elsewhere, so it possibly is just a glitch or something at either end. Thanks, martin

[midas]

Hi, Martin, multiple problems like you're having with the V3i are difficult to diagnose in total without actually seeing the unit and knowing exactly what settings you have going on. Did you try going back to the White's dealer that sold you the machine and get some in depth training? The dealer should be more than happy to take as much time as needed to help you out.

[Lowjiber]

Martin...

I'm not sure why you were denied access, yadda, yadda. However, I just had a thought to share as a possible explaination:

When you initially logged in, did you set a specific time to stay logged on? If so, the forum may have timed you out while you were writing your post. Therefore, when you tried to post the comment, the forum didn't realize you were a member.

Could be...HUH? (Just a thought.)

[MartinL]

Martin...

I'm not sure why you were denied access, yadda, yadda. However, I just had a thought to share as a possible explaination:

When you initially logged in, did you set a specific time to stay logged on? If so, the forum may have timed you out while you were writing your post. Therefore, when you tried to post the comment, the forum didn't realize you were a member.

Could be...HUH? (Just a thought.)


I bet that's it, or my DSL line mighta blinked off and on. This 2Wire modem is prone to do that at times. Yes I did leave the login time where it was originally. I'll fix that, thanks. martin

[CyberSage]

Hello Martin,
I am Glad you made some progress with the depth readings on the V3i. That's great news. If you have your all metal set to 75 and not getting a good response from the target in pin point mode, there is definitely something strange going on. There is one possible answer I can think of right off hand. If you pull the pin point trigger while the coil is to close to the target or any other metal object it will manually ratchet down the all metal sensitivity. I think you are probably all ready aware of this, and this is not the real issue. There is not a separate volume control for the pin point mode. It is controlled by the Audio - Target Volume settings. You mentioned rubbing the coil right on the ground while pinpointing. I actually use a technique known as scrubbing. If I am in a grassed area, I keep the coil right on the ground when I hunt. Let me describe how I go about pin pointing a target. After finding a possible good target I visually mark the center of the motion mode responses. I lift the coil in the air about a foot and squeeze the pin point trigger. I lower the coil to one side about 2 feet away, and find a quiet area. (no response from the pin point mode) I then rest the coil on the ground and release the trigger. Squeezing the trigger again and holding it, I move to the approximate location of the target. Don't lift the coil off the ground when you do this. I get really good pin point audio response using this method. You might also Try using Lock Track, in case this is a ground balance issue.
Martin, if enough snow melts enough this weekend I will try and shoot a video over a 8 inch test coin I have buried in the park last year. Hang in there buddy, we'll get it figured out.

Jack

[MartinL]

Thanks. I just have to feel that the answer is in the audio settings for the pin point mode. I will exercise your pin point method tomorrow. Why the tone would fail above 7, yet the color bars would be active and a depth registered pretty close top the search display, just like a normal episode under 5. The color bars did have white spaces at the leading edge of the scroll though, if that's important. I'll take it a little slower in the morning and see if I can get back to that one stage where I could get both tones. It is extra odd though that the pinpoint tone volume would be so low and broken at 7, and yet the 3 freq discrimination mode pings pretty good. Shouldn't the all metal pin point mode be a honkin' compared to the multiple frequency search mode's return? I hope it's just a simple setting or something I am doing wrong. I do seem to do a fair job of hunting under 6 so there I have some valid procedure with pin pointing those levels.. martin

[giant056]

I really am having a blast with my V3i, the whole learning experience of it has been enjoyable I think. The only other programmable detector I've used a lot was the Eagle, I did have a Garrett that I had done some bartering for but never had much luck with it.

[MartinL]

The pin point methodology you use didn't make much of a difference for me when I tried it this morning Jack. I was able to get tone after loading your CJ and Yahoo's CJ programs. The tone in PP is still very sketchy at only 7. Anything more than 7 gives a lot of information about the depth and the freq bars, just no tone. There has to be an easy answer here. Thanks for sticking with me on this, martin

[Nitro 54]

You might just have to reload the programs that are giving you fits Martin.. It's worth a try.

[MartinL]

Reloading programs has been a real savior for my sanity's sake. Thanks Glen.

thumbsup01 WTG Martin! Would it be possible for you to list the settings of the program you are using? It might give us some insight as to your PP issue. The V3i has so many audio and on/off toggles in the menus that it would be easy to overlook one. Are you using the Wireless Headphones? HH...KYBuzzBox


martin

I am not using headphones of any kind, even though I do have a pair of Golds. You are right,,,lots of audio on/off toggles to be concerned with. Right now I have a PP tone in VCO I find too low for my ears. How I changed it, I'm not sure, but it can be fixed. I could shoot you the audio settings I use if that helps. martin

[midas]

I am not using headphones of any kind, even though I do have a pair of Golds. martin
[/quote]

There's the problem on not hearing the audio in pinpoint. The pinpoint has a much quieter tone variation than the Disc circuit. Headphones to hear the pinpoint tone on deep targets is a must. :bop:

[MartinL]

I am not using headphones of any kind, even though I do have a pair of Golds. martin


There's the problem on not hearing the audio in pinpoint. The pinpoint has a much quieter tone variation than the Disc circuit. Headphones to hear the pinpoint tone on deep targets is a must. :bop:


Seems odd to me that the search, 3-frequency mode makes decent audible noise, and the PP(all metal) one has to have some help. Wouldn't it make sense that the search mode response should be even more affected by depth? What am I missing in this analogy? martin

[midas]

In disc modes, a lot of the v3i programs use no modulation which makes deep targets give the same loud response as shallow targets. The pinpoint mode has no such adjustment, so the deeper the target, the less of an audio response there is.

[MartinL]

In disc modes, a lot of the v3i programs use no modulation which makes deep targets give the same loud response as shallow targets. The pinpoint mode has no such adjustment, so the deeper the target, the less of an audio response there is.


That makes sense, thanks. martin

[MartinL]

In disc modes, a lot of the v3i programs use no modulation which makes deep targets give the same loud response as shallow targets. The pinpoint mode has no such adjustment, so the deeper the target, the less of an audio response there is.

Midas,

I still have to ask another question. My V3i seems to be fairly strong in in PP-tone for targets 5 or less, but goes to dismal at this planted 7 penny. Is this a V3i multi frequency downside issue, or does most all detectors crater in PP sound when they hit 7? God help me if I want to hope to search and find anything in 9-10 depths if this is what's normal for a 7 penny.

How about anyone with a V3i telling me the cemantics for their finds when they do find 10 coin targets? Does VCO tone whistle, even with headphones? Just how do you do a routine for a deeper target of coin size?

This information might will help a lot of peeps besides me, IMO. martin

[midas]

ALL detectors in pinpoint mode will give fainter tones the deeper the item is. When you have a coin 8 inches down or more, the tone will be distinct, but will be fainter than the tone on a shallower coin. That's how you tell a coin IS deep without even looking at the depth meter. When I detect I really don't even look at the V3i display to determine if I should dig it. I go by the sound the detector makes in Disc and in Pinpoint mode. I have been detecting since 1965, and every detector I have used (and there's been many), will give a less loud signal the further away from the coil the coin is. The best teacher is experience. Wear headphones, set the discriminate to accept everything from 0 to 94, and dig everything that sounds good in Disc and reads below 4 inches. As you dig and learn what targets sound like and read out on the display, you can start cherrypicking the signals that you want to dig. Then you will start getting the deeper, older stuff. The V3i is the best machine I have used for getting the coins everyone else passes over. I have dug coins down to 12 inches (measured with a ruler). The 12 inch coins in pinpoint do not blast your ears off, but give a pinpoint tone that is barely audible. You then start digging and check the hole with your pinpointer as you approach the estimated depth. I use the DX-1 pinpointer as it can detect a coin 4 inches from the tip. Hope this helps.

[wagon wheel]

Great info folks...it gives insight to some of my same problems/questions on my V3i. Can't wait for the snow to melt so I can give some of these suggestions/recommendations a go.

Much Thanks for the learning session!!

w.w.

[xzlr8n]

I agree with Midas' last post, this is what I've experienced with my V3i, DFX and MXT. I have found the Disc depth reading on the V3i to be far more accurate than the Pin Point depth reading, sometimes by an 1 or more.

[MartinL]

Midas,

Should I not be able to detect coins at 8 and hear PP tone without headphones? What details can you share about your find at 8-12? Please give me a replay of events from some of your deep(8-12) finds with the V3i. Something like this: I heard a valid tone in disc, and then switched to PP mode and (fill in the blank.) Did you have head phones on all the times you found an 8 coin If not, then did you get audible tone in PP? Thanks. I'd be very interested to hear anyone's rendetion for their finds at 8 and more. A replay from memory for what you experienced might really help a V3i owner determine if his particular unit is defective, without having to spend the money and time of sending back home for a check up. Thanks. martin

[wagon wheel]

MartinL, I feel myself right in tune with your questions and needs regarding the V3i. The feedback being provided is equally appreciated by me as well!!! I have been frustrated with my inability to get the most out of my V3i and I know a lion share of the problem comes from the individual running the machine...at least that's what I'm hopeful of until I learn otherwise. Thanks to all for your willingness to share and provide encouragement on this topic. :cheering: :cheering:

w.w.

[MartinL]

MartinL, I feel myself right in tune with your questions and needs regarding the V3i. The feedback being provided is equally appreciated by me as well!!! I have been frustrated with my inability to get the most out of my V3i and I know a lion share of the problem comes from the individual running the machine...at least that's what I'm hopeful of until I learn otherwise. Thanks to all for your willingness to share and provide encouragement on this topic. :cheering: :cheering:

w.w.


Let us both hope that we get some meat and potatoes answers here Friend. This thread began with a much better fever than it did on that other forum, but it feels to me that feedback seems to have dwindled after I reported I saw 7 with the almost absent PP tone. You and I have a way to go before we can be happy campers, huh ;-) martin

[CyberSage]

Well, I guess I will share my experience digging deep coins for you. I have dug many coins now in the 9 inch range, and a few that approach 10 inches. That being said, I should also mention that I have dug thousands in the 6 to 8 inch range. I have used the MXT,DFX, and V3 and gotten what I consider to be deep finds. Midas has given you the simplest answer there is. That answer is experience teaches best. We can accelerate the learning curve by taking advantage of the forums and books and hunting with a buddy who has experience. The later being one of the most advantageous in my opinion.
As mentioned previously the pin point volume will decrease faster than the discrimination mode audio responses. The coins that I have found in the 8 to 9 inch range have in many cases presented them self as only a light variation in tone in the pinpoint mode. At this point I would like to recommend that you get a good set of headphones. They do help significantly, and help you focus on the task at hand. On more than one occasion I have had to start the pin point procedure over several times to get a good response from a deep target. It is by no means always obvious. Pinpoint does get difficult for me after 7 to 8 inches sometimes, especially if I am dealing with EMI of any kind. It gets real light and wispy sounding. I have my volume set fairly high, but I am a little hard of hearing. The higher volume made a difference for me. Experience is going to be your best friend. Get out often in locations that give you a chance to find those old coins. If your getting used to that penny you buried at 7 inches, bury another one at 8 inches and experiment. Trust me on what I am about to say...

If you can get a good hit on a coin at 7 inches in motion mode and pin point it, you have the ability to find a hell of a lot of old coins that are still out there just waiting for you. Take what you have learned and find a few coins at depth. I had a huge break through myself this last spring. I hunted right next to a guy who pulled coin after coin. I watched him closely. He moved slow and deliberate, and one more thing, he also happened to be hunting where the coins were. Make sure you hunt where the coins are. ;) I went back the next week and followed his path through the park. It was one of the best Silver days I ever had. Martin, with your steadfast determination and persistence I know you will be digging deep coins in no time. I will do my best to answer questions for you, but get out there and hunt with the new found knowledge you have acquired. Then make sure and share the results. Little steps my friend.

Jack

[MartinL]

Jack,

I really appreciate the patience you have with me when I get frustrated, thanks. Let me ask a few focused questions:

1. Are self-buried nickels, dimes and quarters not good test items, especially the quarter since it's bigger? My nickel in air tests always make my PPr(Pro Pointer) perform at it's best, 2+. Yet I have several nickels buried since last summer, at 4-6 and it's a struggle to get tone on them even though I know exactly where to swing. Did you chose the penny at random?

2. If the sensitivity bars(3 freq) are dancing nicely with slow and smooth swings in PP mode for say the 7 penny, after getting search tone, but get no audible tone in PP, doesn't it make sense that Whites screwed the pooch a little by not making the audible PP tone, in tandem and interactive with the display of the freq bars when they lock, rock and roll during the silence of the PP tone?
Seems logical that Whites should have.

3. What do you find is the depth limit for PP tone WITHOUT headphones? BTW, I have a set of Sunray Golds, and as memory serves me, I do not remember getting any better audio @ PP after the 6 depth audible tone wall I hit in open ear mode. I will re-visit the new Golds(they ain't hardly had the dust blown off them yet cuz of the summer temps) on these buried experiments I have now. That'll be my task first thing for today, plus burying the 8 penny.

4. Are you possibly switching to less than 3 frequencies for your deep performance experiences?

I keep seeming to come back to 5900, sorry. If my old 5900/Di shows a reading of 8-9 on the analog display, I dig 8-9 targets at that depth and have found coin targets at 8-9. Seems illogical that a :usaflag:ship model of the same company's can't exhibit that ability. I used my 5900 yesterday to quickly search the uncovered road bed, because I KNEW it was reliable. That thing must be 20-30 years old, and still rocks without all the bells and whistles. Had to do over again, I'd bought the MXT Pro instead of the V3i, but I'd feel guilty pawning this V3i off on anyone now, unless it was for a massive loss on my part. That has been what many new owners have done, both new THs and some seasoned TH as well.

I'll let you know how the day goes with the headphones. Thanks again! martin

[CyberSage]

Good questions Martin. Lets take them one at a time.


1. Are self-buried nickels, dimes and quarters not good test items, especially the quarter since it's bigger? My nickel in air tests always make my PPr(Pro Pointer) perform at it's best, 2+. Yet I have several nickels buried since last summer, at 4-6 and it's a struggle to get tone on them even though I know exactly where to swing. Did you chose the penny at random?

All are good items to do your testing. It depends on what you are hunting for. I chose a copper penny because it was similar to my most common old coin finds, which are Wheats and Silver Dimes. I believe these are probably the most common coins still out there, so I use it for my testing because the VDI response of a copper penny falls very close to that of the above old coins. I just can't bring myself to bury a Silver Dime. lol Your Pro Pointer responded better to the Nickel because it is a lower conductive target. The pro Pointer has an Operating Frequency of 12 kHz which favors lower conductive targets such as the Nickel.



2. If the sensitivity bars(3 freq) are dancing nicely with slow and smooth swings in PP mode for say the 7 penny, after getting search tone, but get no audible tone in PP, doesn't it make sense that Whites screwed the pooch a little by not making the audible PP tone, in tandem and interactive with the display of the freq bars when they lock, rock and roll during the silence of the PP tone?
Seems logical that Whites should have.

Hmmm? This may be your issue. In PP mode you should not be swinging in a slow smooth pattern. It is a non-motion mode. You should be finding a target free area near your dig and squeezing the trigger. Then move to the target area and adjust the position of the coil so the 3 bars on your screen are the longest possible. They should be fairly steady, not dancing up and down. As mentioned earlier, the variation in tone with VCO turned on with a deeper target is going to be quiet. I could not hear it with out the use of my headphones. You can turn up your all metal setting a little to help out. I have mine set at 75, which is pretty high.



3. What do you find is the depth limit for PP tone WITHOUT headphones? BTW, I have a set of Sunray Golds, and as memory serves me, I do not remember getting any better audio @ PP after the 6 depth audible tone wall I hit in open ear mode. I will re-visit the new Golds(they ain't hardly had the dust blown off them yet cuz of the summer temps) on these buried experiments I have now. That'll be my task first thing for today, plus burying the 8 penny.

I have my volume turned way up for external speaker use. I always hunt with headphones, I use the Grey Ghost originals. In my test garden I often don't use headphones and can hear a coin in pinpoint at 8 inches or so. Remember I have my speaker volume turned way up though.



4. Are you possibly switching to less than 3 frequencies for your deep performance experiences?
[/quote]

I have hunted in Single frequency 2.5 modes in the paste and found some deep coins, but I am pretty stuck on the correlate mode for most of my hunting.


Well I have no knowledge on the 5900/Di. That's a little before my (metal detecting) time. lol I think Whites has produced a great detector. They have had there problems, but in the end I think they have truly landed a :usaflag:ship model with the V3/V3i.

Jack

[russellt]

use 2.5 single freq in m/m pro. turn up the recovery delay to 100.make sure tone ID is on .gain 13 ac.80 dc.70. use the 7.5 filter and you should get some deeper targets. a quarter at 8 -10 inches are not going to vdi at 83. it will be bouncy like kathryn hepburns head in a uh -60 under evasive manuevers. like vdi 78 to 72 something like that and the tone ID will sing everytime your coil passes over it . thats the key for me .i also changed my tones to be progerssively higher for higher vdi's. also create a high tone for 17 to 19 so you cant get those nickles. hope this helps bro..... russellT

[wagon wheel]

good lessions...I'm feasting on every word and I'm eager to give them a try. Much thanks!!!

w.w.

[M-Taliesin]

Howdy Folks!
Meanwhile, with all the angst for V3i owners and time spent trying to get along with a real sketchy machine with questionable performance, lots of time invested in playing with settings, I've been raking in the finds like crazy with my MXT Pro.

Sometimes more just ain't better at all, but simply time devoted to everything except the goal of finding the goodies.

My own V3i might become the subject of my next video at the pistol range.
Can't see how it could blow me away otherwise!

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

[RWJR13]

:grin:.....M-T....your never at a loss for words... thumbsup01 thumbsup01

[CyberSage]

Mel,
There was a time when I would have agreed with you on this. Up until this last Spring my deepest coin was found with the MXT. The ground tracking on the MXT is superior to that of the V3/V3i in my opinion. While they have added tones now to the Pro version of the MXT, it is still a single frequency detector. This is it's drawback when it comes to digging deeper coins. The MXT runs at 15 kHz, which is not the ideal frequency for deeper coins. It does handle EMI better though. Shallow targets are not at issue here. When it comes to deeper targets having the multi frequency pinpoint saves a lot of digging that you would be doing with the MXT. Trust me on this, I dug a lot of rusty tipped nails and rusty bottle caps with the MXT. Everything sounded the same to me. Most will agree with me in the statement that tone hunting goes hand in hand with finding deep coins. The higher range of audio tones on the V3/V3i accommodates this need nicely. The MXT Pro has tones as well, but not enough to get that nice rolling response that I listen for. The V3/V3i is a bear to program for most folks. The preset programs are still very conservative in terms of Filter settings. I preach on this a lot. I read a statement by Jimmy Sierra where he talked about the uncanny depth using the 5hz Filter. This is the key to getting deep. My soil is moderate to high strength as I approach the foothills of the rockies. The lower filter setting always gets me more depth and sensitivity. All of the pre-loaded programs with the exception of one have very high filter settings. This is a huge problem for beginning V3 users in my opinion. I can make a deep target in my coin garden disappear simply by adjusting the filter from 5hz to 7hz. With proper settings not only will you get deeper with the V3, but you increase your sensitivity to shallower coins that are mixed with trash targets. The MXT relies on separation alone to see these targets. The V3/V3i uses separation along with priority logic to find these targets in situations that would be masked out for most other detectors. I would say that most of the old coins I find now have something else in the hole with them. We really need to get together Mel. I want to get my hands on your V3i, and your MXT Pro as well! lol

Jack

[giant056]

I have to agree with you Jack my V3i definitely hears deeper targets than my MXT, the only way that I could truely tell would be to bring along my MXT and mark the target, go back to my truck (which might be half a mile away) and check it with my MXT, maybe some day. My brother has a stock Minelab SE and there's a ballfield where I was digging some super deep Indian's last summer, one day he told me if I ran across what I thought was a deep Indian to let him check it, well probably only 45 minutes into the hunt I got a good signal, he came over and checked it, he couldn't pinpoint it, he said he could tell there was something there but he said that he doubted if he'd ever heard it hunting normally, it was one of them deep Indian's and I let him hear and see the great response my V3i was giving plus here the constant good tone, you'll never convince me that a V3i won't go deep, I know better. Back when I was using my MXT we compared a lot and every time we both got good diggable readings. I never use my Super 12 anymore cause I do better with the D2 on both the MXT & V3i.

Mel when you did your factory reset is that when your V3i started screwing up really bad? I am kinda wondering if maybe the eeprom isn't screwed up in it from the last time I heard you talk about it. I'm sure they have an eeprom in them, but whether or not it's separate by itself or integrated into a microprocessor I don't know.

[rsarge1]

Martin hang in there Jack will get you straight, I was gonna ask you if the VCO was on but you already knew about that because it sounded like the problem I had when I got my machine back I have gotten quarters down 9 inches in my test garden but the only thing i've found down 9 inches in the field is crushed pop cans LOL like they say you have to be over it, keep trying it will come around.

[exsquid]

The V3i gets screwy when you change one parameter, such as the VCO or an audio threshold, and you can't get it back by simply returning the setting back to original. I have to do a formal restore of the file and start over. What kind of electronic device these days requires one change at a time, and then forces you to sweep clean to the original status? It makes it darn difficult to tweak and actually believe you have the concrete, top level performance from these V3is. Seriously, I was in success mode an hour ago. Tweaked one thing in audio and than it was worse, so a reverse of the setting would make you think you'd be back to the current success, right? Whites really needs to address the firmware, the hardware GUI so called live controls and how they act together on the fly. I am not impressed at all.

I'm taking a brake. martin


OK, I don't have a V3i and I don't know all of its lingo but I would swear that I read somewhere that the V3i had global paremeters that can be turned on for each setting (perhaps) so all new programs are linked to those settings and they are automatically inserted into the programs otherwise the settings are left alone so that each one needs tweaked each time. Things like volume and threashold can be set and not bothered with each time a new program is created.
Could this could explain why some things are reverting back to other settings maybe??

Just trying to help... I suspect White's has enough technical knowhow to design it smart...

[M-Taliesin]

Mel,
There was a time when I would have agreed with you on this. Up until this last Spring my deepest coin was found with the MXT. The ground tracking on the MXT is superior to that of the V3/V3i in my opinion.
<Snip>
We really need to get together Mel. I want to get my hands on your V3i, and your MXT Pro as well! lol

Jack


Howdy Jack!
I'd be up to visiting with you and checking out my V3i whenever you have some free time.
Since I just had surgery a couple of days ago, I am playing things close to home for the moment, but that shouldn't last very long. I'd surely appreciate your having a look.

I personally believe the master reset I did on the V3i hosed up the calibration to the point it has become useless. That's an issue I still chafe about considering it was highly touted by a forum moderator and dealer on another forum.

If we can spare me the trouble and expense of sending it back to White's, that would be helpful. But I don't have particularly high hopes that things will improve much without doing that. It is nothing short of noisy to an extreme at low gain (65) and with discrim also very low (2). All metal at 45. My last attempt was in Texas, and it was totally useless with only tons of falsing at that setting.

Hope we can hook up, as I am not working at present.

Blessings,
M-Taliesin

[giant056]

From what you're saying Mel it definitely sounds out of whack, it's very possible this master reset that moderator had posted(I remember it vividly) on the Website corrupted the eeprom or a processor. Seeing how it's out of warranty by now, myself personally I would take it apart and take all voltages out of it to start with and try it after that first. I've fixed many digital electronic components that had nothing but a confused processor in them. A lot of them processor's have a super capacitor near their voltage supply and if that processor is confuse (that's my own laymen description) it ain't gonna work or it ain't gonna work right. You have to take that voltage away completely. Super caps will hold a charge for a long long time. When eeproms get corrupted there's no fixing them without the right equipment but they're very cheap to buy(if you could get one). If Jack can't get nowhere with it I'd say ship it to Whites and they'll fix it.