Test garden disappointment...

[jkress]

So... taking some good advise, I made a small test garden. I planted a Franklin half, silver quarter and dime. All laying flat at 7 inches down.

The next day I had a little time and decided to hear exactly how the silver sounded with the Explorer (w/stock coil). I was quite shocked to find out that the machine barely picked up on the half and quarter... couldn't even see the dime. Nothing even close to a solid signal for numbers or sound. I boosted the sensitivity and switched to Deep, but that only made it slightly better. I also noticed that the best tone came to the right or left of the target... depending which way I was swinging and I was swinging very slow. Most of the time I could get the signal to hit in the high conductive range, 26-29, but the FE range was way up there too... like much of the iron I have been going over lately.

I decided to grab my Ace 250 with stock coil and see how that did... believe it or not, the Ace gave me a little bit better id on all three coins. Not a solid signal by any means, but just a little better than the Explorer SE Pro. I did have to swing the Ace much faster for it to even register the coin.

How can this be:huh: Is a test garden not a reliable source comparison for deep silver. I don't consider 7 inches deep for this machine. Granted the coil was probably close to an inch off the ground.

Any thoughts? Does this sound right?

Thanks,
jk

[Epi-hunter]

Newly-buried coins are not going to be representative of what you will hear from coins that have been in the ground for a long time. The halo effect, and all that (we once had a thread that went into very detailed, engineerish-level rationale as to why that is, but I just call it the halo effect and let it go there lol ). It really does make a lot of difference. Newly-buried coins will not give you the same result.

That being said, I would think your SE should do at least as well as the ACE. Would be interested in hearing what your sensitivity was set at. Also, were you swinging VERY slow with a very small footprint to lock in to the target?

[coinnut]

A couple of things that may ease your concerns. Fresly, disturbed soil is a killer for Minelabs and many other machines. Some machines may handle it better . Maybe the Ace does, but that is not how the real world is. You may also know your Ace better than your Explorer, so that is a big disavantage to the explorer. Your iron mask, sensitivity settings, and any number of other settings may affect it. Test gardens work better and better every year that they get older. If you dig out a hole and then reburied that dirt, the ground may take years to compact, even if you pound it in. There are lots of airgaps in that dirt. Besides that, the Minelabs really shine in trashy areas. Even though the Explorer failed in your tests, I think you need someone who has one to guide you through it a bit more. Most of the machines that I have owned that did not perform as well as I expected, were usually my fault lol Not saying that is the case here, but for me it was lack of knowledge on my part. I bet someone will be able to explain it a bit better than I can.

[tanacat]

I made a coin garden and was 'furious' with my XLT for not picking up even a quarter
at 5 :ticked: So I went and traded her in for a V3i to show her who was boss...

Oops didn't know at the time about the halo effect 8/ But I like my new machine much better anyway.

[pulltabsteve]

I made a coin garden and was 'furious' with my XLT for not picking up even a quarter
at 5 :ticked: So I went and traded her in for a V3i to show her who was boss...

Oops didn't know at the time about the halo effect 8/ But I like my new machine much better anyway.


:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: You showed her! thumbsup01

[Cheap Thrills]

Many years ago I planted a beach toast silver quarter in my back yard at a measured six inches deep . I ran my Golden Sabre 2 over it and nothing . After a while I even forgot where exatly I buried it . It was about 3 yrs. later I hunted where I thought the spot was and heard the faintest little sound in all metal and that turned out to be it . Air tests and test gardens may be preffered by some but I'd rather go out and find a wild coin in it's natural habitat (actually I'm afraid I might lose the silver test quarter ). rofl

Baba

[jkress]

Newly-buried coins are not going to be representative of what you will hear from coins that have been in the ground for a long time. The halo effect, and all that (we once had a thread that went into very detailed, engineerish-level rationale as to why that is, but I just call it the halo effect and let it go there lol ). It really does make a lot of difference. Newly-buried coins will not give you the same result.

That being said, I would think your SE should do at least as well as the ACE. Would be interested in hearing what your sensitivity was set at. Also, were you swinging VERY slow with a very small footprint to lock in to the target?


I had a suspicion it probably wasn't going to be an accurate test. I just wanted to hear the tones.

First, I swung the SE on factory coin mode. After nothing there, I increased the sensitivity to 27 and just started to pick up some tone. Not high silver tone... but some tone. Then I set the machine on Deep... which helped a little more.

I did get out again tonight to try something else. I switched to the Iron Mask mode and that helped even more. Definitely not the high shrill of silver, but a repeatable tone.

Thanks for your response. It's nice to hear confirmation on what I expected about the halo effect.

[jkress]

You may also know your Ace better than your Explorer, so that is a big disavantage to the explorer.


Yeah, that thought entered my mine too. The hours I put in on the Ace is light years apart from what I have put in on the SE.

Only one way to remedy that!! :yes:

Thanks for the info.

[jkress]

I made a coin garden and was 'furious' with my XLT for not picking up even a quarter
at 5 :ticked: So I went and traded her in for a V3i to show her who was boss...


lol lol lol

Nice to know I am not the only one that got stung. ;)

[jkress]

(actually I'm afraid I might lose the silver test quarter ). rofl
Baba


Once the SE didn't hit on the coins, I decided I needed to mark where they were before the plugs healed and blended in. lol

Thanks for the info.

[CyberSage]

A freshly buried coin can be very hard to detect. The more the mineralization strength of your soil increases the more difficult it will be to detect a freshly buried coin. When you dig to bury the coin in your garden the soil matrix(density) is changed from that of the surrounding ground. This can often be enough to confuse the filters of the detector. There are exceptions such as sand, but most of the time it will cause the target to break up easier. If you carefully cut a very large plug as deep as you possibly can keeping the plug intact, you will get better results. I have done this only to find that the response of the coin is elevated higher than it should be. Still not the best solution. It is much like the effect you get when finding a coin right next to a sidewalk. If you are burying silver coins you should get accurate results with a couple years. I personally don't believe silver will give off much of a halo. Copper coins can actually become harder to find even with the more pronounced halo effect associated with copper and brass. If your soil PH is highly acidic it will encourage deposits to form causing a masking effect. I have found Wheats around the base of evergreen trees(Pine) that were very iffy signals and came out of the hole with green deposits. A few feet away at the same depth exposed to the leeching effects of water from a sprinkling system I found wheats that looked great and sounded great. There are a lot of things that can effect the reliability of your coin garden. The best results come from actual finds in the field. Experiment over these finds before you dig. I generally don't have the discipline it takes to do this lol but, When I do... I have gained some good knowledge.

Jack

[tanacat]

Thanks Jack that was good info... my quarter was clad I haven't found enough silvers to bury any yet lol I'm greedy, want them all in my collection book.





lol lol lol

Nice to know I am not the only one that got stung. ;)



Actually, I'm feeling guilty what I said- I need to give my XLT more credit. All my finds down here in my profile have been with my XLT (Love ya girl :cheesysmile: ) I had a battery leak in my V3i and have a claim with Proctor & Gamble to get a new one. I only used her for a month, have been using XLT with great success lately.

[dave in iowa]

great post , i use the iron mask at 22 and i also check out just nails ,so the upper left hand cornor is blocked , i switch back and forth on those and check my signal, i use manual sens , seems better as high as i can without it getting jumpy, i also noise cancel more than once . sometimes 3 or 4 times in a couple hour hunt and always when i got to a different area, even with the iron mask and the nails blacked , i still get nails that almost sound like a good coin , good info on the coin garden , i tried one , never had to much success with it , i too most the time dont have the patiencet to wait before i dig a good signal , also i dig about every high or semi high signal no matter where the target might be , unless its in the extreme lower right cornor

[jkress]

great post , i use the iron mask at 22 and i also check out just nails ,so the upper left hand cornor is blocked , i switch back and forth on those and check my signal, i use manual sens , seems better as high as i can without it getting jumpy, i also noise cancel more than once . sometimes 3 or 4 times in a couple hour hunt and always when i got to a different area, even with the iron mask and the nails blacked , i still get nails that almost sound like a good coin , good info on the coin garden , i tried one , never had to much success with it , i too most the time dont have the patiencet to wait before i dig a good signal , also i dig about every high or semi high signal no matter where the target might be , unless its in the extreme lower right cornor


Thanks Dave... good to know what works for you. I'll give your advice a try next time out.

[little man]

hey I hope this help you some when your hunting with a new metal detector try digging all your hit if-s to for the frist 6 mo or longer I take a little note book with me a and write thing down as for the test garden try it after a rain but it chage from month to month I got about 24 thing in my garden from a cast iron coffee pot at 2 foot and a silver dollar at 20'' but ever hunting place is differ

[jkress]

hey I hope this help you some when your hunting with a new metal detector try digging all your hit if-s to for the frist 6 mo or longer I take a little note book with me a and write thing down as for the test garden try it after a rain but it chage from month to month I got about 24 thing in my garden from a cast iron coffee pot at 2 foot and a silver dollar at 20'' but ever hunting place is differ


Thanks for the tips LM... I appreciate it.

[Tin Nugget]

Newly-buried coins are not going to be representative of what you will hear from coins that have been in the ground for a long time. The halo effect, and all that (we once had a thread that went into very detailed, engineerish-level rationale as to why that is, but I just call it the halo effect and let it go there lol ). It really does make a lot of difference. Newly-buried coins will not give you the same result


This is true although I am not sure how much is halo and how much is disturbing the soil. Next time you find a coin at 6 plus inches, drop it back in the hole, refill the hole and re-sweep it, you will be surprised at how much weaker it is.

[coinnut]

This is true although I am not sure how much is halo and how much is disturbing the soil. Next time you find a coin at 6 plus inches, drop it back in the hole, refill the hole and re-sweep it, you will be surprised at how much weaker it is.


For me, disturbed soil is a definite drawback to finding coins. Any construction site around here is harder to work than if it was undisturbed. Somehow, packed soil allows the signal to penetrate better. I think a test gargen needs to settle for a bit. Your type of soil probably dictates how long it will take to settle enough to be considered long term.